• Creator
    Topic
  • #122671

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    Have a 1999 Tiara 3100 with twin Cummins 6BTAs. Starboard engine is original 1998 version, port a 2015 version. Do not know history behind newer engine. It does not smoke like older engine at idle.
    Only 700 hours on older engine. Turns up to 3150 WOT neutral. 2650 WOT under load. Getting new props to allow turn up to 2900. Do not know why wrong pitch props on boat. Cannot re-pitch to what is needed.
    Installed envirovent on starboard engine yet top filter clogs with oil pretty fast. White smoke seaps out at idle. Putting hand over oil fill port at idle feels no real suction or push.
    Appears that boat was used by a realtor group for years as means to view waterfront property. Assume a lot of low speed ops that loaded up engine. Older starboard engine may be coked up, rings fouled, injectors fouled, valves off, etc.
    Looking for ideas to remedy. Assume I should (in this order) adjust valves, clean/adjust injectors, use Marvel top oil to clean rings.

    Any help appreciated.

Viewing 20 replies - 1 through 20 (of 24 total)
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  • #125197

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    One more question:

    can I locate smaller bypass vent filter closer to #6 and turbo inlet filter vs being close to #1 inlet? Closer to turbo inlet allows some of the escaping smoke to be drawn into turbo inlet.

    #125176

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Thomas,

     

    Pulling off #6 valve cover on an in-line drive with a 6BT /BTA 5.9 is the absolute worst place to vent this engine.. #1 is OK but the timing cover is superior except in V-drive applications..

    #125164

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    Tony/Rob

    Does it make a big difference where EnviroVent draws from? I.E. #1 cover (front of engine) vs #6 (rear)? I know hot air rises but not familiar with 6BTA internals.Ā 

    Thanks

    #125049

    Rob Schepis
    Forum Moderator
    Vessel Name: Tenacious
    Engines: 6BTA 5.9 330's - "Seaboard Style"
    Location: Long Island, NY
    Country: USA

    You could move that cover back to #1 and put this at #6:

    Cummins B-Series Oil Fill Valve Cover Kit

    #125039

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    Tony

    Attached are pics you asked for. Engine access is limited so oil fill valve cover moved to #6 vs #1. I located envirovent inlet at #6 oil fill port. Was planning on drilling a hole in #1 valve cover and relocating enviro vent inlet to #1. PITA to remove vent tubing to allow oil fill cap removal. Neither engine uses much oil.

    Front gear case pic is from port engine (better access for pic) but both engines have same setup- glenndining syncho uses access cover on both. Cannot locate envirovent on front of stb engine.

    Thanks

    Tom

    #124836

    Clark Leighs
    Participant

    If you keep up with Tony and it sounds like now,Ā  Victor, since he has been through this with the same model,Ā  you will get some help.

     

    I also strongly suggest that you look through Tony’s Tips on this site and read all of his exhaust articles and you will begin to understand what he, and Victor,Ā  areĀ  getting at.

    And reread my post about how to figure out how much height above the outside water level your turbo has.

    It is important.

    1 user thanked author for this post.
    #124833

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Why did you install a Valve cover “Envirovent”Ā  Plus, on the aft valve cover for what looks like a inline drive???

    Post a pics showing the entine top of the engine, 1-6 cylinders and the front expansion tank

    Ā Post a pic of the timing case in front of the injection pump

    Post a good pic on the injection pump side of the engine

    #124812

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    1999 6BTA blow by continued

    Getting back to the blowby issue after holidays, and had a knee replacement, and Daughter had another baby. Busy two months.

    Tony- See attached pics of Envirovent install on starboard 6BTA. Let me know if there is a better approach. Thanks

    Victor- would like to share ideas since you have same year boat. Pls reply. Thanks

    #122904

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Tomas,

    Unless you post good pics of all to do with your Envirovent, I cannot help..No close ups–want to SEE all..

    #122898

    donald roth
    Participant
    Vessel Name: Paumalu
    Engines: Cummins 6BT 180 hp
    Location: where the fish are!
    Country: United States

    Why go to 4 blade props?
    Unless thereā€™s a specific reason to run them, Iā€™d stick with the 3 blades, modify existing props to get sorted out before purchasing new ones.
    Regarding the exhaust geometry, youā€™ve got to let go of the notion that anything that comes out of the factory is perfect!
    You most definitely need some dry risers to protect your motors from ingesting raw water.

    #122879

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    My boat was over propped. Only turned up to 2650. Had twin bronze Dymex 20 X 27. Not the original props. I took an inch out of pitch, still only turned up to 2650 loaded. Since cannot repitch to where it needs to be, going with Nybral 4 blade 20 X 22. On order now.

    Vince- Can you share your new riser design/dimensions? What about the port side?

    No kinks in Envirovent system. I will be moving the valve cover tap from #6 that has oil fill port to #1 so it is easier to add oil at #6. Will drill hole in #1 and relocate suction tube. It could be any of the valve covers. I assume front of engine near gear box is better. Suggestions???

    Has anyone run engines real hot for a duration to try to burn off carbon deposits?

    #122868

    Dan
    Participant
    Engines: Cummins
    Country: USA

    Thomas,

    Thereā€™s no doubt your waterline is higher than you think, the engine rebuilds at very low hours, seized turboā€™s are telling the story, it looks like you have room the fix the problem – post pics of the entire E/R .

    If in doubt, to get an accurate measurement of your waterline you could close the seacock, remove the hose, attach a short length of hose to the seacock and hold it above he exhaust hose on your engine and mark where the waterline is, be careful, when you open the valve there will be a lot of water, only open it a little bit.

    You would be mistaken to presume that because Tiara put the boat together they got the exhaust system correct.

    With the envirovent it cant work properly if not plumbed correctly, have a close look at the hoses and see if there is any dips in the hose that can fill with oil and block the suction, post some pics of that install.

    #122862

    Victor
    Participant

    Been through it and have the participation trophy to prove it.

    Going off memory, i think the waterline is 8 inches to the centerline of the turbo.

    you can see some drops in the picture as well as soot from being over propped.

    #122858

    Rob Schepis
    Forum Moderator
    Vessel Name: Tenacious
    Engines: 6BTA 5.9 330's - "Seaboard Style"
    Location: Long Island, NY
    Country: USA

    Thomas, not sure where/what you measured as related to this comment: “Wet exhaust water entry hose is more than 12ā€³ above waterline

    The requirement is that highest point of the exhaust system is dry and at least 12 in above the loaded waterline.

    No way that engine room with OEM wet elbows meets that spec. Looks like Victor has been there..

    #122856

    Victor
    Participant

    blow by

    i have the same boat (year and power). Same issue. they were over propped from the factory. Be interested to hear what props are on the boat. i had to remove an inch of pitch to get mine to turn 2900.

    as for smoking from the breather, i managed it by moving it close to the air filter.

    the exhaust is getting salted, you will see it when you take the mixer off. thatā€™s why. you have new turbos. i made risers to manage that. attached is my starboard that i just finished

    #122831

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    Tiara Exhaust height and Blowby Issue

    Measured exhaust system. Wet exhaust water entry hose is more than 12″ above waterline. Exhaust exits are above waterline fully loaded. All pipes /hoses angle down. See pics.

    Regarding blow by, I have smoke coming out of envirovent filter at top of engine at low speeds/idle. Blower barely keeps up with it so some smoke gets into cabin if I forget to turn on blower asap. Pretty sure I have an issue, looking for some ideas to remedy w/o having to do a ring job. I plan to do a balance check first, then adjust valve lash (hopefully valves are not fouled open), then pull injectors to clean/check flow, then add Marvel oil at next oil change.
    Any other ideas that might help? Thanks

    #122808

    Antonio Guzzo R.
    Participant
    Vessel Name: Intima
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA
    Location: La Guaira
    Country: Venezuela

    back to blow by…

    If the envirovent suction from the turbo air filter canĀ“t keep up with the blow by and your engine room fills with fumes… probably you have a cylinder/rings wear issue. You can do a blow by test to be sure. https://www.sbmar.com/articles/measuring-blow-by-the-real-test-for-internal-engine-condition/

    Long idling periods and/or long idling speeds like the last owner used the boat can lead to premature cylinder wall wear.

    #122799

    Clark Leighs
    Participant

    *******Engine room blower barely keeps up with smoke at low speed ops. Once turbos kick in it iOS OK.***********
    Not clear what you mean. Is there smoke inside the boat, the engine compartment??

    FOr checking the exhaust system in comparison to the water level a clear vinyl tube can be used.
    Adapt it to a nearby seacock. Install a small ball valve on the other end. THe valve can be quite small as can the hose, maybe 1/2″ OD.
    Take the B.V. hose end with you as you check the heights of various components.
    When you want to check something hold the hose end somewhat above the part you want to check and then open the ball valve.
    THe water will rise untill it reaches the same level as the seawater outside.
    Take your measurement which will be from the seawater level outside.
    Then once these points are measured you can measure the points for distance around the E.R., clearances distances from one part to another and so on.

    This is not my idea. I just though it very good.

    #122777

    Thomas whittemore
    Participant

    Tony
    I will have to go measure how high exhaust wet entry is above waterline. Exit ports are a above waterline at rest.
    What about adjusting valves, clean/adjust injectors, use Marvel top oil to clean rings IOT reduce blowby? Engine room blower barely keeps up with smoke at low speed ops. Once turbos kick in it iOS OK.
    Thanks tom

    #122742

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Look at this picture –Do you think your engine installation qualfies?

    There is a reason for that 12″ spill over heigth and you are experiencing exactly why.. I’d bet you are less tha 6″..

Viewing 20 replies - 1 through 20 (of 24 total)

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