CAT 3196 660hp

[JimmyK]

Not familiar w/the CAT line. What is the good/bad about the 3196 660hp? Twin engine installation in a 43’/30klbs express.

Topic

[Rob Schepis]

Douglas, same here as to engine(s) first, boat second, when in the market.  I am surprised this concept is not more mainstream….

[Douglas Fairchild]

History of Cat 3096 After coolers

I read an article in a boating magazine about ten years ago regarding that engine and it’s problems.  There was a class action lawsuit over constant after cooler problems with that model.  Article stated Cat made 9 redesigns in 8 years of the after cooler and still problem was not corrected.  When I began looking for a boat I researched engines first. choose the engine I wanted,   450/480C Cummins and then looked at boats that had those engines.  No regrets.  

[BrisHamish]

Yes, the potential is a failed aftercooler core that has leaked / misted salt water into the engine core. That was a ‘higher than normal’ potential on the 3196, unfortunately.

I dont know whether CAT released modified / updated aftercoolers for the 3196, but they did do that for other engines which had aftercooler problems (eg the C7), so again worth checking with your local CAT dealer.

[JimmyK]

No doubt it is going to be a process. My goal is to have something by next June. I am ready to move fast if needed but the intention is to take my time and enjoy the process. Also buying and renovating a house at the same time so there is competition for available cash.

With that said, getting back to the 3196, I’m assuming the potential issue is leaking aftercoolers and getting saltwater in the engine? What was the fix? A redesigned aftercooler? Assuming for a second the engines didn’t have the aftercooler failure, is this generally a good engine?

[Steve Lewis]

We were in your shoes

My wife and I were in a similar position. We were nailing down all aspects of the “Next Boat” hunt and we finally decided to go after a few 48 Sundancers of the 2006 – 2008 vintage. Straight shafts and QSC’s. I relate our search story in that document. I guess I could update it even more since we just completed an entire season with the 2005 460 Sundancer that we ended up buying. Circumstances had us in the position of having closed on the sale of our boat and not having any specimens of our preferred boat on the market.

So we ended up buying a boat at the lower end of our budget range and we are mid way through spending most of the difference to update this boat. The boat was in better shape than anticipated so we ended up feeling that we had not over paid. Now we just need to execute on the upgrade projects.

Our mechanic will replace the cylinder heads. We will have 1 more inch taken out of the prop pitch and finally upgrade the navigation electronics. The cylinder head and electronic projects are expensive but when you compare the difference in price for what we bought to what we had wanted, we feel like we are coming out ahead of things a bit.

We are in a boat that is the same size as the 48 Dancer, but an older style. We are good with that. The structure and layout are good and there are some options on it that we enjoy. Bow and Stern Thrusters and a hydraulic swim platform. We had some ups and downs over the season but in the end we are happy with what we have and will be able to enjoy it next season without having to worry about the valve seats. Also we will be able to cruise the Great Lakes like we intended at the outset of this purchase process.

There is no substitute for getting on a boat and crawling around. You learn tons more than the pictures and write up will ever tell you. Good luck and let the forum know how it can help.

[JimmyK]

thanks Steve, will take a look over that article (may take a while!).

I love the 42 but still nailing down my budget. I have been going back and forth between capping it at 250k or 350k. For 350k the 42 is in play. Not so much if I cap it at 250k.

I should probably go crawl around on some. I don’t mind older to save some $$ but it really seems like the older boats in this size range have the 435hp 3208’s (which are grenades), 3196, or detroits. the 42 is much more modern than the 43, and as you point out, you can get them w/cummins. That’s a lot for that extra $100k or so.

[Steve Lewis]

Give this a read

I wrote this doc for this very purpose. You might find it equal parts review and little nuggets of gold. You will find a variety of engines and drive systems in that size range of boat.

Shafts vs. IPS

6CTA/QSC
QSM11

Volvo D9/D11/12

CAT 3176/3196/C12
CAT 3208 in the 375 or 435 trim

You might even run into some Detroit 6V-92 engines depending on vintage

Lots to evaluate. For Fun…… Here is a QSM powered 4200 Open in Detroit.

https://www.platinumyachtsales.com/boats-for-sale/2005-tiara-yachts-4200-open-saint-clair-shores-michigan-8065408/

4 users thanked author for this post.

Tony Athens, JimmyK, ablicpa, Mike Uliasz

[JimmyK]

Thanks guys. I’m just starting to get serious about my next boat. Thinking ~38-44 foot express. The boat I was referring to here is the Tiara 43 Open. As we know, about half the purchase is the boat and the other half is the engines. Really no very knowledgeable about engines in this HP class so will be doing lots of research…expect more threads like this.

If anyone wants to post up various motors in this HP class along with which are lemons and what to look out for with each engine that would be fantastic.

[BrisHamish]

“Aftercoolers had issues back in the day. You will probably want to run the engine serial number(s) through your local CAT folks to see if that/those engines fall in that time frame. ”

Steve is exactly right about that.

Also check with CAT whether either of these engines you are looking at (a) ever had an aftercooler fail in the past, and (b) when the aftercoolers last had new cores.

Because of the history, (and whether rightly or wrongly) boats with 3196 engines sometimes do not command the highest resale prices.

[Steve Lewis]

Aftercoolers had issues back in the day. You will probably want to run the engine serial number(s) through your local CAT folks to see if that/those engines fall in that time frame. You can always use that as a negotiation point if it comes to that. Require ALL maintenance records and look for the usual oil changes and fuel filter changes but also look to see if there are any major items that show up as being worked on or replaced.

Also engine loading seems to be a universal issue…….

What boat brand and model are you looking at? Any pictures or is this a research project at this point?

[Author]

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