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  • #78836

    Mike Schmidt
    Participant
    Engines: Cummins 6bta 330hp

    Well, I did something stupid. I was cruising along at 2400 RPM and when I went to slow down I accidentally pulled the shifters out of gear instead moving the throttles. Seems to me that’s hard on the transmissions, but to make matters worse, without thinking, I instantly put them back into gear again (still at 2400 RPM)! I didn’t hear anything bad and there are not symptoms of anything haywire, but did I do any internal damage??? The fluid looks fine… no leaks… isn’t slipping.

Viewing 6 replies - 1 through 6 (of 6 total)
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  • #79351

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    The MG506 is a really “good ol’ gear”, but is very light duty in comparason to what they’d put in off road equipment on a HP to HP basis.. A gear similar to a 506 would be rated to about 80-100HP in loader or tractor vs. 200+ HP in a boat. The “shock loads” just are not there is a boat, it’s all thru a “fluid medium”–The prop ….

    Tony

    #79347

    donald roth
    Participant
    Vessel Name: Paumalu
    Engines: Cummins 6BT 180 hp
    Location: where the fish are!
    Country: United States

    Tony,
    Thanks for your input!
    Iā€™ve seen forklifts, backhoes and tractors with transmissions that externally look the same as Velvet Drives and Twin disc.
    Although Iā€™ve never gotten inside one, Iā€™m sure that the internals must be much more robust, and as you mentioned, protected by a torque converter.
    As far as boat transmissions go, I always advocate the use of single lever controls, so that any shift of gears MUST involve bringing down the rpms first.
    I operate a large single screw vessel, and docking the beast sometimes requires a good deal of shifting, so a transmission failure could lead to some quite expensive damage.
    I want to believe that the Twin Disc 506 under the hood is capable and reliable as I squeeze in alongside my neighbors gleaming yacht!

    #79333

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Donald,

    I was not familiar with the the “shuttle term” as to transmissions so I looked it up.. Based on what I read and could surmise, I’d guess the basic design is based on the combo “oil in shear”wet clutch design and a full lock-up design after initial changing of gear the the from fwd to reverse…There might even be a fluid coupling with a lockup feature in it hidden it the design.

    But I would also surmise this………..These transmissions are many times more robust as to both external size and weigh on the HP to HP basis compared to a marine transmission used in planing hulls where weight and size play a major part in design ( or actually” lack of” weight & size)..

    Let’s take s ZF220A gear–Rated to close to 400HP at 3000 RPM ( like on the back of a QSB 3.9 380).. Under 120 lbs.. Maybe a front end loader from the 70’s & 80’s with a 200 HP John Deere had a “Shuttle Gear” gear that weighted over 1000 Lbs?.. It’s not a “apples to apples” comparison.

    On the other hand, we do use heavy duty marine gears on lower HP engines that have very smooth engagement and you can shift back and forth at maybe 1000 RPM and you hardly feel the shift as the clutches build pressure over a 2-3 second period that are designed to slip in the “oil-in-shear” mode during this process.. A typical gear we use weighs about 400-600 lbs and are used on a 200-300 HP engines. That would not be “performance or fit friendly” in a 28-30 Ft 8000- 10000 lbs performance boat. Our start-up videos show many of these gears “in motion” ..

    Anyway, “shuttle gears” are a neat design.

    I am going to post a design & video we put together in a commercial application about 25 years ago that will get you thinking as to shifting fwd to reverse. Just have to get it from a VCR tape to U-Tube 1st–That’s a “Corey job.. He has not even seen it..

    Tony

    #79262

    donald roth
    Participant
    Vessel Name: Paumalu
    Engines: Cummins 6BT 180 hp
    Location: where the fish are!
    Country: United States

    Maybe veering off topic a little, I see huge similarities between marine gears and ā€œshuttleā€ gearboxes used on heavy equipment.
    These boxes can be shifted hard against massive loads all day long for years without damage!
    Iā€™m not advocating this on a boat , but I am curious.
    Any experts on here that can point out why a marine transmission cannot do the same?

    #78864

    Mike Schmidt
    Participant
    Engines: Cummins 6bta 330hp

    Go Fishing.. But, donā€™t do it againā€“

    Tony

    I like that answer!

    There is a zero chance of that happening again – ever!

    #78843

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Go Fishing.. But, don’t do it again–

    Tony

Viewing 6 replies - 1 through 6 (of 6 total)

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