Cummins Marine Diesel Repower Specialists › Forums › Cummins Marine Engines › 1993 Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1 Engine stops

  • Creator
    Topic
  • August 21, 2017 at 9:04 am #22074

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Turbo has been sticking periodically but will finally kick in was hoping to get through the season before replacing. Last time out was running at 2050 rpms and engine lost rpms and stopped. Seemed like it was starved for fuel, changed primary filter. It started right up but shortly after cut out around 1200 rpms.
    Had to limp back to the dock at idle speed unless it would stop at higher rpms. Do you think it’s the turbo charger causing the problem or something else?

  • Creator
    Topic
Viewing 20 replies - 1 through 20 (of 25 total)
1 2
  • Author
    Replies
  • October 13, 2017 at 6:43 am #23847

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Engine Shut Down

    Tony,

    Thanks for confirming that the vacuum pressure is indicating a fuel pick up problem. Now I can chase that down and hopefully correct the problem.

    Rick

    October 9, 2017 at 7:22 pm #23718

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Pulling that kind of vacuum means only one thing only———-Have you even tried to breath through a straw?

    Off course you you a fuel supply issue between the fuel filter and the bottom of the tank..

    Tony

    October 9, 2017 at 8:10 am #23694

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Engine Shut Down

    Since I couldn’t find any electrical issues, I decided to check the fuel supply. I pulled the Racor 500 Turbine fuel filter and cleaned and rebuilt with new gaskets and orings. I added a vacuum gauge to the filter and it is running around -40 to -50 kp depending on rpms which seems a little high. I’m wondering if there could be a fuel pick-up problem at the bottom of the tank? The filter element is clean, fuel in bowl is clean.
    Any thoughts on if this could be what’s causing it to shut down over 1800 rpms under load?

    September 11, 2017 at 6:51 pm #22888

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Turbo charger “sticking” means only ONE THING–You are getting water up the exhaust…. This WOULD NOT cause the engine to shut down.. Your builder put in a poorly designed exhaust system–that is Plain & Simple..


    Engine shutting down    –You are loosing fuel supply.. Why?? Could be an air leak, clogged fuel filter, supply issue, or an engine wiring issue intermittent voltage/current to the fuel solenoid……..You would normally think the fuel solenoid is either “on or off”, but it can act as “in-between” with poor connections to it..,,.. Only you and your “due diligence” can sort out “on-boat” wiring connections..

    Tony

    September 11, 2017 at 5:49 pm #22884

    Rob Schepis
    Forum Moderator
    Vessel Name: Tenacious
    Engines: 6BTA 5.9 330's - "Seaboard Style"
    Location: Long Island, NY
    Country: USA

    Rick,

    Have you verified the fuel tank venting is clear? Try running with the fill cap off on a calm dry day?
    Have you pulled your dip tube and inspected it?

    Last time the Racor was the culprit. Have you considered pulling the Racor and cleaning & rebuilding (resealing) it on the bench?

    As far as that riser Corey posted – that’s not a Seaboard production product, Corey just posted that for info purposes. It was custom made by an ex-Albin owner for his own boat, which he ended up selling. No two installs are the same (as you already noted) so there’s no “off-the-shelf” for something like this, too many tight and critical clearances at hand..

    September 11, 2017 at 11:12 am #22866

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Engine Shut Down

    Checked electrical connections all look good, fuel lines all tight, no leaks, turbo no oil leaks visible. Took it out for a test run. When trying to power up to 1800 rpm so the turbo can kick in, it wouldn’t go past that, no smoke. After a short period at 1800 rpm maybe a minute or less it started to loose rpms and shut down. Checked the priming pump and it had no pressure. Pumped it up a bit and the engine started up again. Got back to the dock at 1000 rpms.

    Do you think it could be a bad priming pump or something else? It’s a manual pump.

    Thanks

    September 6, 2017 at 11:09 am #22707

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Engine Shut Down

    The turbocharger is clean, no signs of oil leaking anywhere. If oil was getting in the after cooler, wouldn’t there be blue smoke in the exhaust. I didn’t see any smoke from the exhaust.

    Priming pump seems to pump up to pressure, but was not much pressure when it shut down. Pumped it after shut down and it started up.

    Thanks,
    Rick

    September 5, 2017 at 9:31 pm #22687

    dwimaryadi
    Participant

    dear rick white,
    1. is your turbocharge oil leak? normally if your turbo leak,…the oil will come to your after cooler,…and this case air consumption become poor or no enough,
    2. check your fuel priming pump,…electrical or manual type, make sure they working on good suction and delivery

    September 5, 2017 at 11:28 am #22649

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Engine Shut Down

    I wasn’t able to find the main fuse in the wiring harness. Any idea on where to look?
    I checked all the wires and connections, they looked solid and clean.
    Ran engine for 25 minutes with no problems ran smooth with no shut down or loss of rpms.

    I did notice that the low pressure feed pump plunger was hard to press as it did have fuel pressure both before starting and after. When it did shut down, the plunger had no or little pressure until I pumped it and it started up.
    Is that common?

    Thanks

    September 1, 2017 at 7:44 am #22545

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Engine Shut Down

    I’ll check all the connections this weekend and try it out.

    Thanks!

    September 1, 2017 at 6:40 am #22541

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Sounds electrical to me….23+ yrs?? ……………………..Bad connection to the fuel solenoid under the fuel pump, bad connection in the plugs, etc.. Do you know where the main fuse is in your engine harness?

    Air leak–No clue as there are so many possibilities

    Tony

    August 31, 2017 at 1:19 pm #22524

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Engine Shut Down

    Thinking back the first time it sputtered for a second or two and shut down. The subsequent shut downs were similar. I’ve had fuel filters clogged and it would slowly loose rpms over a few seconds this was quicker. Do you think it could have sucked air from a loose fuel line fitting, one was a 1/4 turn loose?
    Thanks

    August 31, 2017 at 12:17 pm #22520

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    If a fuel issue, it would take seconds to a minute or so to shut down………..

    If an electrical issue, it’s usually like shutting off the key..

    Think back–How fast did it shut down???

    Tony

    August 31, 2017 at 8:16 am #22514

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Exhaust Design

    Excellent, that might work. If you look at the picture I sent showing the elbow, it seems my engine is an inch or so more forward or the engine hatch edge is smaller and close to the turbo and exhaust elbow. If I use that elbow you pictured it would be right up against the engine hatch edge.

    Do you sell that exhaust elbow? Part # ?

    Thanks for all this information on the turbo problem, but it doesn’t address why my engine stopped running the last time out. I did find a fuel line fitting that was a 1/4 turn loose. Do you think it was sucking air and causing it to shut down? We had been running for about an hour at 2050 rpms when it happened. I changed the Racor Filter which wasn’t bad, no water in the water separator. It started back up and when I powered up to 1200 rpms it shut down again. Pumped the LP pump and it restarted. Ran for awhile at 800 rpms cut out a couple more times back to the dock. I’ve been hesitant to take it out for a test run if someone thinks it’s something more serious. Thanks

    August 30, 2017 at 4:04 pm #22499

    Corey Schmidt
    Forum Moderator
    Vessel Name: Rebel Belle
    Engines: Cummins
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    No doubt removing the engine will be a lot of work indeed… when you do the work, make sure that you have the proper SPILLOVER point above the waterline…

    The Albin design is really tough to work around…

    August 30, 2017 at 1:48 pm #22495

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Exhaust Design

    Corey, thanks for the input. I did look at Tony’s specs on exhaust system design and see that the exhaust elbow would need to be changed to inject water below the turbo, just don’t know if I have the clearance until I take a close look at it. The real problem in that replacement is going to be how to get the turbo off being so close to the engine hatch edge, no room to back it off the bolts without pulling the engine. Thanks again.

    August 30, 2017 at 12:49 pm #22491

    Corey Schmidt
    Forum Moderator
    Vessel Name: Rebel Belle
    Engines: Cummins
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    Root cause…

    Rick, in an effort to clarify —- I think what Tony is saying is that if you DO NOT change your current exhaust system design, that even if you do replace your turbos, they will eventually let SEAWATER into the turbo/engine again and you be right back where you started… this is the real important lesson here…

    You have a DESIGN issue, not a TURBO issue…

    August 30, 2017 at 7:35 am #22463

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    Yes, It’s an Albin Tournament Express with a V drive. I do plan on replacing the Turbo this winter but the big question there is how do I get it out. You can see how close the turbo is to the engine hatch rim.
    The engine stopping I agree is another problem. I didn’t find any water in the Racor fuel/water separator and the filter wasn’t really bad but replaced it anyway. I did find one of the fuel lines on the high pressure side about a 1/4 turn loose, but no fuel leaks. Do you think it was sucking air? Ran it at the dock for about 15 minutes after tightening that with no problems.

    Thanks Tony

    August 30, 2017 at 6:32 am #22461

    Tony Athens
    Moderator
    Vessel Name: Local Banks
    Engines: QSB 6.7 550 HP
    Location: Oxnard, CA
    Country: USA

    All your pics were finally uploaded.. Corey will remove the duplicates.. Yes, the forum had a “glitch’–sorry

    #1————–You are not going to like this, but 100% for sure you are feeding your turbo saltwater/raw water due to a poorly designed exhaust system………It’s you call if you want to address this, but it’s only a matter of time before you drop a valve.

    #2–The engine stopping is a totally different issue–Could be fuel, could be electrical..

    Is this an Albin with a V-drive?

    Tony

    August 28, 2017 at 9:36 am #22405

    Rick White
    Participant
    Vessel Name: White Goose
    Engines: Cummins 6BTA 5.9 M1
    Location: Dighton, MA
    Country: United States

    6BTA 5.9 M1 Engine stops

    Over the weekend I checked all fuel fittings and found one of the lines on the high pressure side about a 1/4 turn loose. There was no fuel leaking but I wonder if that was enough to introduce air into the system.
    Checked all electrical connections, made sure fuel shut off solenoid was free and working. Starts up easily and runs well at the dock. Hesitant to take it out without learning why it was shutting down.

  • Author
    Replies
Viewing 20 replies - 1 through 20 (of 25 total)
1 2

You must be logged in to reply to this topic.